The suffering that Jesus went through was not punishment for sins. It was as much as anything the natural consequence of the free choices of his tormentors. Crucifixion, scourging, etc. were very painful and ugly processes. The people who were doing this had accused Jesus of blasphemy and they wanted to harm him. He knew that it was going to happen, and yet submitted himself to it. This was part of his willing sacrifice for us. There was simply no way, with the culture of the times, for him to make the sacrifice without some pain, but it wasn't God punishing him for our sins. I've heard the same argument from some Christians that Jesus was punished. The scriptures don't really support that line of reasoning. Scripturally, our sins are forgiven. 1 John 1:7-9 says (paraphrased) that the blood of Jesus (his sacrifice) purifies us from all sin. If we confess our sins, God being faithful and just will forgive us. It is absolutely just for us to not be punished if our sins are forgiven, and similarly it is absolutely just for Jesus not to be punished if our sins are forgiven because being forgiven means that the sins are wiped out as if they never occurred.
You asked if it were a sacrifice, couldn't Jesus have lived and not died on the cross (giving up Heaven would be sacrifice enough). Unfortunately no, for several reasons. First, Jesus was Jewish and he spoke mostly to Jews (although his message was for everyone). One of Jesus' purposes was to fulfill/complete/finish the old covenant. By Jesus' actions, he rendered the old covenant obsolete, but part of the old covenant dealt with a blood sacrifice for sins. This symbolic sacrifice (up until Jesus) was replaced with the true sacrifice of a sinless (perfect, without flaw or blemish) person giving up his life for us. This is a true act of love, to give up one's life for another (See John 15:13), and this shows how much Jesus loved us, that he was willing to give up his physical life for us to be free from sin. Second, Jesus fulfilled the prophecies about the Messiah. In fact, it would be impossible for anyone today to do so for a variety of reasons. One of those prophecies is that he would indeed be killed and one who would oppose God would be given dominion for a while (see Daniel 9 among others). Third, the people, who had free will, wanted him dead. Yes, God allows us free will even though we choose to go against God. The free will of the Jews would have left two choices for Jesus: 1) Use Godly power to avoid the people's will -- this would effectively be eliminating free will and would be controlling the people 2) Submit to the people -- although painful, this would result in accomplishing the first two reasons above as well as maintaining God's commitment to free will. Fourth, defeat of death. Jesus did indeed die, but his resurrection and subsequent appearance to hundreds of people as proof of his resurrection, showed that death could not overcome God. Christians know that death is not the end, but that the promise of resurrection at the end times will be fulfilled, just as it was with Jesus. Without the resurrection, Jesus was just a good man, the resurrection showed that he was much more than that, but the resurrection doesn't come without death.
![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png){kind=small}
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
timeasmymeasure
Re: What God is offering
Date: 2010-10-28 12:35 am (UTC)Sorry for the delay in responding.
The suffering that Jesus went through was not punishment for sins. It was as much as anything the natural consequence of the free choices of his tormentors. Crucifixion, scourging, etc. were very painful and ugly processes. The people who were doing this had accused Jesus of blasphemy and they wanted to harm him. He knew that it was going to happen, and yet submitted himself to it. This was part of his willing sacrifice for us. There was simply no way, with the culture of the times, for him to make the sacrifice without some pain, but it wasn't God punishing him for our sins.
I've heard the same argument from some Christians that Jesus was punished. The scriptures don't really support that line of reasoning. Scripturally, our sins are forgiven. 1 John 1:7-9 says (paraphrased) that the blood of Jesus (his sacrifice) purifies us from all sin. If we confess our sins, God being faithful and just will forgive us. It is absolutely just for us to not be punished if our sins are forgiven, and similarly it is absolutely just for Jesus not to be punished if our sins are forgiven because being forgiven means that the sins are wiped out as if they never occurred.
You asked if it were a sacrifice, couldn't Jesus have lived and not died on the cross (giving up Heaven would be sacrifice enough). Unfortunately no, for several reasons.
First, Jesus was Jewish and he spoke mostly to Jews (although his message was for everyone). One of Jesus' purposes was to fulfill/complete/finish the old covenant. By Jesus' actions, he rendered the old covenant obsolete, but part of the old covenant dealt with a blood sacrifice for sins. This symbolic sacrifice (up until Jesus) was replaced with the true sacrifice of a sinless (perfect, without flaw or blemish) person giving up his life for us. This is a true act of love, to give up one's life for another (See John 15:13), and this shows how much Jesus loved us, that he was willing to give up his physical life for us to be free from sin.
Second, Jesus fulfilled the prophecies about the Messiah. In fact, it would be impossible for anyone today to do so for a variety of reasons. One of those prophecies is that he would indeed be killed and one who would oppose God would be given dominion for a while (see Daniel 9 among others).
Third, the people, who had free will, wanted him dead. Yes, God allows us free will even though we choose to go against God. The free will of the Jews would have left two choices for Jesus: 1) Use Godly power to avoid the people's will -- this would effectively be eliminating free will and would be controlling the people 2) Submit to the people -- although painful, this would result in accomplishing the first two reasons above as well as maintaining God's commitment to free will.
Fourth, defeat of death. Jesus did indeed die, but his resurrection and subsequent appearance to hundreds of people as proof of his resurrection, showed that death could not overcome God. Christians know that death is not the end, but that the promise of resurrection at the end times will be fulfilled, just as it was with Jesus. Without the resurrection, Jesus was just a good man, the resurrection showed that he was much more than that, but the resurrection doesn't come without death.
-- continued --